Peter get off your high horse about Ulster football. It makes your comment look ridiculous.

There are 8 traditionally strong teams in the football; Galway, Mayo, Cork, Kerry, Meath, Dublin, Cavan, Monaghan. Cavan and Monaghan for YEARS decided who won the Anglo-Celt cup as they had little to no competition, bar the years where a dark outsider like Derry would storm up for a year, claim an AI and go back to dormancy. This was football until the early 90′s.

Why in all that time have Ulster won so few? Connacht and Ulster went on a drought spanning almost FORTY YEARS in the where none of their teams won Sam between them, and indeed only got to a final when Connacht champions played Ulster champions. Your statements of the “easier” provinces making teams more likely to win Sam is ridiculous. Mayo have had decades where we swept Galway away and got little return in August after the 50′s until ’89. Galway the same, it took their great team in the 60′s to save face. Cavan and Monaghan had no competition in Donegal, and 90% of the time had weak teams against them from the North.

Look at the other end of the spectrum; Kerry. Kerry have years of weak Cork teams, have had weak teams themselves and still they managed 3 AIs a decade. Luck? Easy province? No. You don’t get lucky 35-odd years. That’s more than Double Connacht’s (an “easy” province) and Ulster’s total combined.

Stop bemoaning Ulster’s position, they had decades of opportunity. The early 90′s and 00′s were the exception in terms of Ulster strength. The previous 100 are the rule. There was football before ’92. Just none in Donegal.

That’s a reasonable point, Joe. I don’t think Gilroy had much choice though; what are you supposed to do when someone parks a bus in front of the goals? He did play more defensively than Gavin generally, but nothing like Donegal.

There was a little thing in the North called the Troubles which might not have helped. Since peace Ulster have won the most championships and we continue to have this lop-sided provincial championships where the only show in town for the first two months of the summer was the Ulster championship despite the poor play.
Tradition is a great thing to have but we’ve already degraded the provincials – so why not have an equal playing pitch where every team has the luck of the draw might mean you might meet 3 division 1 teams or 3 division 4 teams before the quarters!
Not taking anything away from Kerry but it IS unfair the only team they have to beat each year is Cork – and Cork are more into the Hurling most years.

How are the GAA to be blamed for the Troubles? The simple fact is 90% of the time the North and Donegal were fodder with Cavan and Monaghan Ulster’s big 2. Since the Good Friday Agreement one team has consistently risen from Ulster; Tyrone. Armagh and Donegal were two of the traditional Ulster teams who buck the trend and stormed Croke Park for one year, Derry and Down were traditionally the two who did that. Tyrone have won 3 times and Kerry also have 3.

You are taking away from Kerry. Kerry have 14 AI-Irelands more than Dublin, an amazing achievement when you take a look at the population pools. All of the footballing strongholds mentioned above have to put the small teams away to reach Croker, but nobody has done it as successfully as them. To say Kerry only have to beat Cork is ridiculous, that will only get them into August. There is no such thing as an easy AI, because if there was the vast majority would rest in Munster and Connacht, they don’t.

It’s arguable to say that the 00′s was Ulster’s decade, but the other heavyweights have since struck back. Mayo and Dublin are unquestionably the top 2 teams in Ireland this year, and if you ignore Tyrone controversially beating Monaghan every other provincial winner has successfully made it to the semis, that’s not a fluke either. If Ulster was such a force in football, surely more than two Ulster teams should have featured in the last 2 years?

I realise these won’t be popular opinions on a Donegal thread, but recently the strongest teams in the country have made is to the finals, Ulster’s championship is probably the most competitive, but to suggest that changing the system will make the likes of Down, Monaghan and Cavan champions is ridiculous. They didn’t win because they aren’t good enough to win, which is why the provincial champions dispatched most of them. If you’re good enough you’ll win. The system is fair.

i have no doubt that you know your stuff about football jack, but if you cant understand the relationship between the troubles and ulster football your knowledge of irish history is a bit blurred. helicopters landing on pitches during club matches,constant harassment of players up to and including the shooting dead of aidan mc anespie on his way to training were common place. sorry for interrupting your conversation and good luck next week,but peters reference to the troubles and ulster football hold more relevance than you will ever understand

The system is not fair. Why would a professional organisation like UEFA organise seeded pools – because it is simply not fair that one team for example Real Madrid – get a Norwegian and a Kazak team and say Ajax I’m their group while another consistently get M United, Barcelona, Bayern, inter Milan and say Porto in another. That’s like giving Real a bye every year and giving them the same share of the pot generated by the other matches.
Listen I know people will always get defensive about success. You can’t measure Kerry against Dublin in one sport. Dublin isn’t just a gaelic football county – Kerry more or less is. No doubting Kerry’s achievement but I can guarantee they wouldn’t win as many had they been in Ulster – you can’t argue with the maths.
Perhaps if a coefficient method was used to seed teams in future they could retrospectively work out how many championships kerry would’ve won had they not had a head start.

Shaun a good example might be Crossmaglen Rangers, the amount of titles they’ve won the last 10-15 years.. off the top of my head and I’m probably wrong, but Oisin McConville has 13 County, 10 Provincial and 4 All Ireland club medals.

dead right Joe fair play to you

Shaun, I wasn’t having a cut at the North I’ve grown up listening to the atrocities committed up there, especially if you were to play the nationalist game. My point was simply that because of this they had poor teams who for the most part were beaten by Cavan and Donegal. I should have made that clearer.

I’m sorry Peter but to insinuate all 9 of Ulster’s teams have the potential to win Sam is ludicrous. The current Derrys and Downs are in no way comparable to United Barca. Of all the teams in Ulster, Tyrone look the strongest, or at least the most experienced. Cavan Monaghan and Donegal are nowhere near the barometer Mayo and Donegal have set, they’re much closer to Galway and Kildare.

Dublin have one fifth of the island’s population, and that’s excluding the dubs living in the Satellite counties who commute. Kerry have 120k and are fourteen titles ahead. If just 20% of Dublin played football (and it’s FAR more) that’s already 80k more of a pool than Kerry. David is kicking the s**t out of Goliath on that one.

To say that “if Kerry were somewhere else” is simply begrudgery. A Kerry XV from the past 130 years would beat a XV from any other county hands down. 2nd generation players like Dermot Early Snr and the three O’Shea’s in Mayo can claim Kerry heritage. They’re is just something about Kerry and football, they just excel in the sport.

To use the term “head start” sounds ridiculously bitter. Why haven’t great Connacht teams like Galway and Mayo got 20+ titles each since they’re the easiest province i.e smallest by your standards? Simple. 9/10 times a better Kerry team beat them. If Ulster had the teams to win the AI, they would’ve. They didn’t win, because they didn’t have the teams capable. Simple as.

*beaten by Cavan and Monaghan.

Epic fail there Jack, on all your comments.