Definitely agree Kidney had got to go. We have had over the past few years some of the most exciting players in world rugby and have one triple crown to show for it which we almost contrived to lose. He has squandered our assets with poor tactics and team selections. Please go and send in Conor O’Shea on your way out.

Thats exactly right. Also we have a useless captain and manager. We will never win the World Cup with the loser mentality we have.

Not sure about that. They looked like they were too keyed up on Sunday
Just wasn’t their day. Heaslip dropping 2 balls and giving away 4 pens– I can’t remember him ever doing that. Broken foot for Zebo , torn hammer from a fly hack
Some days the tea leaves are just against you — that was last Sunday and England won by a score
So it ain’t all doom and gloom

@ Chris O’Shea

Sorry Chris – you’re deluded. I hear the same thing from my Mates EVERY SINGLE YEAR. “We were so close”, “We were unlucky”, “Who could predict France would score in the last second”, “The conditions were awful”, “Grand Slams are impossible to win”, “We should be happy with out Triple Crown”

Blah Blah Blah. Excuse excuses excuses. Every year. Every single year there is an excuse. We are, and have been for a long long time – a one match per seasons side. In that, at least, we are incredibly consistent. We put in one massive performance, it gets everyone excited and then we fail to deliver afterward.

A professional side like we are supposed to be shouldn’t make 9 unforced handling errors in one half of rugby. That’s just downright bad. There’s no two ways of looking at it.

We had a LOT of possession in that game – more than enough to seriously trouble England. But we didn’t – certainly not in the second half and particularly when they were a man down.

What will happen now? A loss against France. Two hard fought, scrappy wins against Italy & Scotland.

It’s amazing because the provinces consistently perform at the very highest level, against the best sides. So why doesn’t it translate to the Irish side?

Considering the quality of our players, the performances of the provinces in Europe and especially the mess that England (until recently) were making of their team, the weakness of Scotland and Italy and the up and down nature of the French…its really poor that we haven’t performed better in this tournament.

But – twas ever thus.

Cian I’ve been saying this for two years now. Best winger we have not so much a centre. If Zebo didn’t get injured Keith could have found himself in the wilderness, he now gets a chance to play in his best position.

It will b interesting to see if he’s played at wing will he persist? I reckon Trimble or Fitz will b called up and Earls will b benched again to cover whole back line…

Please god they see the light and play earls on the wing. If darcy or odriscoll are out then I’d play McFadden in the centre, he’s the opposite to earls as he’s a centre playing on the wing ( mainly because of the two above).

Dead right cian ,+ the Irish rugby team are good enough to beat any team on the day ,besides NZ

Sorry to disagree but if it was only consistency then we would have beaten the All Blacks at least once the Kidney years, we must have played them 5 or 6 times since he?s been in charge. We are not NZ standard but we are better than England at the moment, assuming we remember how to catch a ball

We ‘need’

Kidney has used a lot of players of late if you include the AI
And the team sheet has changed quite a bit over the past couple of years
We don’t have a huge choice

Cheers for the comment Oisín. I don’t believe it is sensationalist to ask if we need a reality-check on our current situation.

That last comment was a little heated and not directed at you Patrick, more so the national media in general. I do agree with you on a lot of your points. Its just discouraging to see the roller coaster of reports on the Irish team. Its getting to be a lot like what we’ve heard for the past 20 years from the soccer team. Ive read a lot of your other articles and they are v informative.

Ok, we’re friends again. It is odd to see how the stories have veered wildly on the back of two results.

If it’s a reality check then we’ll be needing a poll.

Although the scoreline is the most vital statistic, Sunday was not all doom and gloom as people make it out to be. Ireland had more possession (60%), territory (57%) and less missed tackles (11 to 4) that England. They also made more line breaks and upfront it was a 50-50 battle against a very physical side (many argue one of the best front 8 in the game). Ireland lost the game due to ill-discipline and unforced errors. You’d swear the way some of the reports are reading that we were beaten by 7 tries by Romania at the weekend. In truth, we were beaten by 6 points by a more than decent England team that is always improving. The shear list of injuries isn’t helping either as well as many of the natural leaders being absent and a pack that needs guidance after the loss of O’Connell as it’s leader. Heaslip is a poor choice for captain in my opinion in that regard. We also lost 2 of our most inventive players within 30 minutes yet still, bar one chip and chase by Youngs/Tuilagi, Ireland were the only team that looked like making any break through on Sunday. Just as I don’t think the win against Wales makes us World beaters, neither do I think the lose to England makes us a weak team. England have a Welsh side with returning confidence in Cardiff and a bruised French team that will hopefully be picking its best team to play in London. All to play for still IMO.

Eoin, maybe the score would give you a job, I enjoyed that read far more than the main article… no offence Patrick but Oisín’s earlier comment was bang on the money for me.

Cheers Glen. In fairness to Patrick it’s not just him. A lot of the country’s rugby commentators were just as frustrated with Sunday’s result as the rest of us. Possibly some of that feeling is coming through their writing. Anyway, onward and upward. If we can get back some of that fan feeling we had on the streets of Cardiff 10 days ago and keep the team injury free, who knows how the next few weeks will turn out. Might see you in Ennis for a pint next time I’m home sure.

Who’s needs a reality check ! , Irish rugby is ok ,we seem light ,but hit hard ,on a below par performance we were 2 kicks of a ball off England ,who not so long ago beat the all blacks ,yes we have little problems ,but who hasn’t ,keep up the writing do Patrick .

Nice backtrack once he responded. Didn?t expect that I guess

Does having played rugby at school or what ever local club at any level give you an understanding of pro players? Do you need to have played rugby to know that dropping balls is bad? do you need to have played rugby to know our bench was weak Sunday, do you need to have passed a ball a few times in the wet for your local club to understand that winning just 8 of the lst 21 games is bad. Do you need to have a Jersey with Irish Permanent on it and not O2 to know that Kidney has no clue what he’s doing?

No, but anyone who has played the game will be more aware of the subtleties and intricacies of what is happening on the pitch, and will be able to ‘see’ more of the tactical and personal battles that are taking place. They will recognise that far from being ‘clueless’, a coach may be making certain decisions for astute tactical reasons which may not be so obvious to non-players.

They know that certain players are passed over in favour of others not because one player is thought to be ‘better’ than another but because one layer’s individual style, strengths and weaknesses are more suited to a particular match, where the other player may be a better selection for a different match. They also know that a player can be having a fine solid match without doing anything spectacular that will ingratiate himself to the casual observer, leading to accusations of that player having a poor/quiet game.

They know that a coach has to play to the strengths of his side and construct a game plan accordingly, and that the weather can indeed adversely affect one side more than another by stifling its strengths whilst playing into the hands of the opposition’s strengths. They will also know the folly of being lured into standing toe to toe with the opposition and taking them on at their own game when you are clearly not capable of matching them at that particular style of play.

They know that just as bad teams don’t become good overnight, so good coaches, players and teams do not suddenly become bad overnight.

They recognise that all teams go through cycles, and that in between peaks there come troughs where teams need to consolidate and rebuild, and results in any given season are not necessarily the be all and end all (witness England’s 2003 world cup squad and the subsequent slump, and Munster and Leinster Heineken cup winning squads and their subsequent dips in form, and Ulster’s rise to prominence over the last couple of seasons).

They also recognise the effect of fatigue and injury following a particularly tough match, and how it can affect the subsequent performance.

Anyone can see the obvious knock-ons, missed tackles etc. but there is far more to an overall performance than that and people who have played the game generally have a far greater insight into what is actually going on and the reasons for many of the (apparently stupid, according to the casual observer) decisions that have been made.

Thanks mattoid — nice to read some sense here

Do you really believe that? It sounds like making excuses for the past 4 years to me. Kidney’s brand of rugby had its day, it was suited to a period of time I the game but rugby moves on. The game changes and any coach who doesn’t adapt watches his team decline. Kicking the ball down the Field or up in the air worked for years.

Whats laughable? We lost, and we lose every year. If it was no for the non-rugby playing public of which you speak the clubs would be nowhere in Europe, anyone worth anything would be gone to France like a rocket. I am sure you have a political opinion, when did you last serve in office?

What’s laughable is that Kidney delivered Ireland’s first grand slam in 60 years, first championship win in 24 years and three above-average finishes since then (not to mention two Heineken Cups) but there are still people on here who think he is clueless as a coach!

A six nations championship is an incredibly difficult thing to win (and a grand slam even harder nowadays). There are six teams trying equally hard to be top dogs and Ireland has no special right to be winning all the time.

A bit of perspective would be good, and the massive swings in popular opinion from one week to the next show that many people on here (while understandably wanting to see success) just do not understand the nature and nuances of the game, or the tactical intricacies.

And to answer your question, I have an opinion on space exploration, but I recognise that astronauts know considerably more about it than me.

For the record, here’s my take on the match:
England were always going to win a ball-up-the-jumper match up the middle of the pitch. Like it or not England are a good side and they are masters at this style of play, so of course thats how they wanted the match to go, to choke the life out of Ireland. Kidney was well aware of this and knew that he couldn’t allow Ireland to be drawn into that as it would have just played into England’s hands.

Ireland’s key to winning the match was to spread the ball and create loose broken play, thereby unleashing the undoubted talent of Zebo (Earls), Kearney, Gilroy and BOD, who clearly had the measure of their English counterparts (witness Earls’ line breaks).

Unfortunately conditions on the day weren’t ideal for the expansive game and Ireland’s strengths were largely stifled by the weather. Handling errors were always going to be a risk, but the alternative (quite rightly avoided by Kidney) was to get blown away by England in the tight.

Another way of creating the broken play which Ireland needed to thrive was to put the English back three under pressure with high balls (albeit pretty poorly executed at times by Sexton, O’Gara, Murray and Gilroy), and this tactic was also used extensively.

I genuinely believe that Ireland would have won the match had the conditions on the day suited Ireland better.

Kidney took a calculated gamble to get the win. It didn’t work out on the day but it doesn’t mean the strategy was necessarily flawed.

The 3 above average finishes you talk about are the last 3 years those 3 years we finished below EO’S teams for the time before. We won triple crowns and finished 2nd under Eddie. Kidney took over and won the big one fair enough but since then we have gone down hill year on year. We have lost 3 in a row to england, Eddie beat England.
Kidney’s has gone as far as he can go

The 3 above average finishes you talk about are the last 3 years those 3 years we finished below EO’S teams for the time before. We won triple crowns and finished 2nd under Eddie. Kidney took over and won the big one fair enough but since then we have gone down hill year on year. We have lost 3 in a row to england, Eddie beat England.
Kidney’s has gone as far as he can go

EOS delivered four second places, two third places and a fourth place.
Kidney has delivered a grand slam, a second place and two third places.
I’m not really sure what your point is?

Shut up would ya

The last three times we played England we have lost and have not scored a try.

I think it refers to our last three games against England..

You can’t count the WC warm up game at all that’s ridiculous. I actually think we would have won on Sunday if it hadn’t have rained heavily and Sexton and Zebo had played out the full match.

If? Ah stop. Ireland were comprehensively outplayed. The grand slam was won in 09, surely the goal is the World Cup, to reach a semi final. That would be progression. Lets aim for World Cup year, lets build towards that. That’s where it’s at folks. Not the six nations.

We have got worse since 2009 how much of a chance do you want

come on now Naes! clueless manager ! really . last week that team went out and blew wales off the park for 40 mins in wales . it was inietitable wales would come back ‘casue number one they are physically massive and 2 they could throw caution to the wind , but we held out . can we do that week in week out?, probably not. We have to remember we have a relatively small playing population and england have more playing union than Aus , NZ and SA combined and even then that have 3 non english players in the side at any given time . it is becoming increasingly hard to compete in a collision sport with countries that produce much bigger athlethes . it actaully a testament to the Likes of BOD , D’arcy et all that they put their bodies in front of 16 or 17 stones sprinters that make no mistake want to run right through you , if you have played at all you’ll know its not easy . look at tthe physical toll the last two week alone . and yet people call it inconsisntency , i dont think so , yes thre was mistake but personally i think its the sheer physicality that is starting to be the difference.

NZ have a population the same as ours – so your point is ?

That’s there number 1 sport, not in this country rugby is our 4th sport. Get the figures for the number of rugby clubs in the two countries, the number of teens playing the sport in both countries. That’s where you make your comparisons. I was in a pub on Sunday where Everton n united was on tv. Parts of our country have no interest in the game. How many rugby clubs in Kerry , in west cork?

England got the ball and wouldn’t give it back. Clever game management from them….

I think to b fair we are well above average (Italy,Scotland). What frustrates us is that we know we are capable of more (Oz Rwc, 1 incorrect refs call from beating NZ in NZ). What we are is freakishly inconsistent…

For me, the announcement after the Wales game that the IRFU appointed a sports psychologist had alarm bells ringing. There’s something wrong with our mentality.

To be fair, when I saw the fixture list this season I worried. I believe such are the fine margins in international rugby that playing Wales and England back to back was a big ask. I feel had we had Scotland or Italy last weekend we’d still b talking about the GS….

Some do. Quinny did. The English fella Goode (not the 1 who played at the weekend) still does. I’m sure its a personal thing but in this day and age of high performance and technical innovation, if a benefit was to b had they’d all b wearing them….

I use to wear gloves for a while when lifting they really help, not bad if you have a few sore fingers for keeping tape on and really help hookers with lineouts for a wet ball. The balls dropped last weekend came down to concentration not a wet ball.

Your guessing if coaches would or won’t work with the irfu. Who knows what these people think.
The simple thing is Leinster Munster and ulster have replaced coaches recently who their fans will tell you are better than what went before. These 3 coaches were practically unknown.

Well, its an educated guess as he fell out with the Irfu when he was with the Not Nots. At the time he said some fairly derogatory (if probably true) things about the senior Irfu mgmt…

O’Driscoll? Kearney?

Personally I don’t think either of them would! People think we’re alot better then we are

Kearney over Dagg ?? Are you having a laugh??

you are trying to make a comparison between the Irish backline and the All Blacks, the best rugby team on the planet since the game was created. absolutely pointless.

none! not one. not even o’Driscoll, not with smith there.

Based on Sunday none. Based on the previous weekend…..1

No ger I’m pointing out to blinded by love irish folk that were not as good as people think! Simple as that!

Hmm… excuses. Its such a loaded word. It implies that we didn’t have full control over our destiny and as such you are right. We didn’t lose that game, the ref didn’t stiff us, the better team won. No excuses.

There are however many mitigating circumstances. Fatigue, Rain whatsherHuber? If we can’t discuss these and if the boys can’t rectify them what’s the point? While there is no excuse for dropping a ball while standing still there is a mitigating circumstance.

Let’s not forget, there is only 1 team who love to beat England more than us and that’s Wales, plenty of rugby yet….

No

.. One likes beating the English more than the Irish!

No…there is plenty of rugby yet….

Or….. lets do what Wales do. Take it on board as a lesson we dont seem to want to learn, conservative rugby wins you very little these days. Wales have incredible belief in themselves despite getting their arses kicked in the HC every year, why? If its not working for them they change it up. We just shrug our shoulders and hope our tactics pay off next year…… 2009 was the year it paid off. I dont fancy waiting another 63 years. Gatland is getting the last laugh on us

@DaMoose;
What sport are you reading about?
The rest of us are reading about Rugby.

Trap out. Lol

Trap out but let there be no Kidney replacements!